The Furious Angels
FA Discussion => General => Topic started by: Tbone on April 13, 2005, 02:23:43 am
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We very rarely tell any of you to do something. When we do, however, it is usually for a very good reason, and thus it is expected that you will listen and have respect enough not to disobey orders when they are given.
To be honest, we were going to kick Venlar out of the faction. He knowingly went against orders and posted on the MxO forums after instructed specifically not to do so. As a result, he caused a huge problem for the faction on the forums, and when my official statement was made, it was compared to his post.
The only reason Venlar is not being kicked out is because we did not make it clear what the reprecussions would be for disobeying the orders. In the future, please be aware that when something is important enough that we give you specific orders, if they are disobeyed, you will be kicked out. It's about mutual respect. We are very easy-going because we expect you all to be mature enough to handle yourselves. In return, we expect the same sort of respect when we do ask something of you.
Remember, you can always come to us with questions. Asking us why we are doing something is one thing, but going against it and not talking to us is another.
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When an order is given, I will obey them. For the faction. And that you are open to questions is essential for me, because I will not always understand the orders, and the grounds for them. Power can easily corrupt, but I don't think that will happen i FA, since we among other things have an open discussion.
Just one question, will there be a possibility to argue your case, if you think that the decision is unfair?
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Of course, just as there always has been.
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I thought so, just wanted to clarify it.
A great leader is one who is respected for the right (good) reasons, and you have my respect.
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Sure....
What He said
vvvvvvvvvvvvvv
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If there is a problem that is affecting FA as a whole, then it is difficult to address it as an individual, and keep separate from FA. Any "trouble-makers" on the forums are just dying to get an "unofficial" response to certain posts, just so they can reinforce their biased, unfounded views, and continue flaming.
FA is high profile in the MxO world.
It is not possible for a FA member to make a post there, without it being read as being an FA statement of sorts.
Naturally, WE are aware that is not what is happening, but from the other side of the fence its not; and that is what we can't control - how others will perseve these posts, so rather than Tbone trying to stop you from saying what you want as an individual, he is trying to stop others from reading individual posts as FA gospel.
Tricky. As you say, ignoring is best.
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Tbone, are we restricted from posting ANYTHING at all... or just in the controversial threads....
for instance, you may remember my In Character thread - To the Merv
http://mxoboards.warnerbros.com/forums3/thread.jspa?messageID=18175#18175
Am I allowed to continue RPing in this thread... as long as it doesn't get hijacked or turn into a flame war?
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Well Gabe, since that thread is in: Enumerator - Hostile » General Discussion .... I would avoid posting there if I were you. We're just waiting for the fire to die out. Let our reputation get back up to max before we post any more.
EDIT: Here is a link to Tbone's original post about this issue...
http://thefuriousangels.com/index.php?topic=2224
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Was this all started over the Shaper Race?
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I won't post about FA, not even a good way - though I doubt T would try and limit our posting about random game issues that have nothing to do with FA, gabe...
any word, Mr.T?
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I have a couple.
#1. How long are we staying out of the event ?
#2. If we are staying out of it for much longer, then I do have a slight problem with this decision to keep out of the events. I am not putting blame on anyone, but I was absent from friday until sunday night. Being that I was away from the game for basically 2 full days, I am already ill because I missed so much events. Now I am being told that because other's actions, I'm not allowed to take place in the events. At the moment it's not really bothering me, but when I do have time to get ingame,(right now for an hour or 2) I don't care to go back to grinding, I would like to keep away from the grind for aslong as possible. And if the event ends on sunday, and there isnt another one for a month, then it is kind of fustrating to know that I now have a month and a week ahead of me of boring grinds. Especially the fact that I will miss out on the storyline because whatever has happened in the last 3 days (actually 5) I have no clue about already.
But that is just my .02c
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We have started being part of the story line. We've stayed out until the arc was over, the new event we hope its a new chapter and such.. As far as being concerned about other peoples action affecting your own, it does. Were in this faction together, good and bad. If anyone of our actions are poor it reflects on all of us and theres no way around that. If its any small help in this matter most of the story line was a silly grind of who can collect most of the fragments from the red eye then n30 agents. It was good to stop doing that.
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so any word from devs? i know theyve kinda stepped up security, but any word from them tbone?
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I'm confused. I see an apology post yesterday from Velnar in which it seems the powers that be have decided to keep him in the faction. People even going so far as to accept his apology, and it appears we are moving on.
Now today I see this post, saying we are kicking him out of the faction.
I dont know about anyone else but I totally disagree with this wishy-washyness in regards to something like this. Is he in or is he out. I think it is extremely unfair to tell the guy everythig is ok, and then wham the next day kic him.
So which is it? Is he in or is he out? When was this decided, and who makes these decision? Is it just TBone's decision? Is it his and the captain's? Or is it the entire factions?
The reason I ask this is because I would like to know how many people need to back a decision like this to remove someone from the faction entirely.
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Archon, please re-read the posts. Then check the dates and times. Part of Venlar's punishment is a bit of a public reprimand. He is not being excused from the faction.
And when it comes down to it, only one person needs to back the decision, and that person is Tbone. He has never done something like that without consulting as many people as he could first, however.
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I just wanted an offical word on the procedure, but it appears from your post that there is no offical procedure as of yet. I will assume it is on a case by case basis.
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Correct. Case by case. Just know it is a possibility that dismissal will be the result if it is severe enough.
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This post came before Venlar's apology. I did not say we were kicking him out. I said we considered kicking him out. There's nothing wishy-washy about it if you read the posts in the correct order.
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There is no official procedure and there never will be. At least not while I'm here.
The day that I hear:
Well in accordance to section 8.1, paragraph 2, I move for a mistrial on the basis of blah blah blah...
I'm out of here.
If you screw up and you know it, something is going to happen. This is not a faction where we have a book to play by. Books just lead to people skirting the rules because they're going by the book. We have a tendency to prefer common sense. Which sort of led us to where we are with this situation. So we made a rule. If we are ordered to do something, we obey. We can question, we can bitch, we can moan, we can suggest improvements, but we obey. So there's one rule. The rest are still in the realm of common sense. Don't let anyone have access to your account falls under that heading. Don't copy and paste things from these boards - there's a reason these aren't public access. Et cetera. Of course, if they're violated, then we'll have to make rules which we don't want to do. The problems with rules and giving orders is that once you make a rule or give an order about something... then you always have to make a rule or give an order about that something in the future. The mark of a good commander has always been one who can accomplish the mission with the minimum amount of orders.
We run like a democracy - listening to everyone's input, weighing opinions, sorting through options. But... ultimately, all final decisions lie with Tbone. There are times when he is privvy to information that the rest of us aren't. You either have faith in Tbone and the way that he makes his decisions, or you don't. :) If I lose faith, I'm gone. I expect the same of everyone.
And this isn't specifically for you, Archon. It's for everyone. Thanks for asking, because a lot of people wouldn't have. :)
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so does that mean the tbone is bush? eww then who'd be cheney? heheh
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Well I am definitly not Blair. Not in a million years.
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I appreciate the clarification that you all have given me. TBone, Ratio. I'm glad to hear that there is no set rulebook, and common sense is the answer.
Being new and away at work at times like these past few days I sometimes miss things in teamspeak or just have never heard them before.
One thing I just caught the other night that I didn't see posted anywhere, was that we are absolutley not to sell anything with melee combat bonuses to it. Which is fine I always try to give any special items I find to coders, but I didn't know it until I heard TBone on chat one night saying somehting about it.
Just a suggestion, if we have some "rules" or "current orders" such as above that everyone should be aware of do we have a spot for them on the site? Maybe we do and I just havent found it yet.
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well ajax, its either u or oronos.
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Maybe we should start a very general thread about some procedural gameplay guidelines that is updated regularly.
Just things that would be common sense for the most part, but that we can check up on occasionally incased we missed a conversation (Like I did, because I've heard nothing of that "no selling melee bonus items" up until I read Archon's post up there) or announcement.
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Possibly a good idea. Usually I say something to anyone I code out something that has a good bonus on it about not letting it get into anyone else’s hands. We can't stop other factions from gaining equipment and cloths that have good combat bonuses on it but we don't need to help them either. This unfortunately then extends to other Zionist, as a few not thinking about it will sell the good stuff as well. This isn't an effort to with hold anything from the general populace, just a way to keep any advantage we might have in our hands and not the other guys. This doesn't mean just melee stuff either but includes any ranged and general combat as well.