The Furious Angels
FA Discussion => General => Topic started by: Tbone on January 20, 2009, 04:11:47 pm
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So the end date for our current recruitment wave is set to end tomorrow at midnight. The game, however, was delayed. Originally the idea was that we would switch up recruitment once the game goes live. So the question is, what should we do with recruitment after the deadline?
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Forum Presence! Create the FA Myst! Challenge!
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I voted for ending recruitment on the originally stated end date/time and start working on a new recruitment method.
"The Challenge" method of recruiting that was used during MxO was what made FA stand out to me. Originally, I wasn't even especially interested in joining up with any group in MxO, but FA's approach to recruitment was what changed my mind. It was also a very clever method of screening potentials who could easily "just say the right things" during an interview.
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I voted for ending recruitment on the originally stated end date/time and start working on a new recruitment method.
"The Challenge" method of recruiting that was used during MxO was what made FA stand out to me. Originally, I wasn't even especially interested in joining up with any group in MxO, but FA's approach to recruitment was what changed my mind. It was also a very clever method of screening potentials who could easily "just say the right things" during an interview.
This.
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I voted for ending recruitment on the originally stated end date/time and start working on a new recruitment method.
"The Challenge" method of recruiting that was used during MxO was what made FA stand out to me. Originally, I wasn't even especially interested in joining up with any group in MxO, but FA's approach to recruitment was what changed my mind. It was also a very clever method of screening potentials who could easily "just say the right things" during an interview.
This.
Agreed.
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Agreed as well. I wasn't sure about factions until I heard about FA all over the forums and got the feel for their presence in game. Then I started the trials and that made FA all the more enticing, that sort of mystery around FA and the fact that you actually have to earn your way in through some work set them apart from everyone else. And, as it has been stated before, the challenge method greatly weeds out the non-devoted players and helps us gain only the best, most dedicated.
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Ok, the masses have spoken. End recruitment at the cut off until we come up with the next thing. Time to put your money where your mouth is. I would prefer to have the next thing ready in 4 or 5 days max. Here's what we're thinking.
*Spoilers below*
Flash based...
Image of dark woods and a path...dimly lit...we hear voices of two Angels, unseen.
FA 1: "Looks like a new one..."
FA 2: "Hmm...well he got this far. Think he's friend or foe?"
FA 1: "Only one way to find out...
FA 1: "Hey you! You've got two options. Tell us what you're doing here or start running!"
Two options appear.
"I was told to follow the path of light" (something like that)
or
"Ok, I'm getting the hell out of here."
Option one makes a light from behind the trees go brighter until it fills the screen. The white turns to blackness. Perhaps blindfold effect.
FA 1 or 2: "Looks like he's waking up."
Tbone: "Sorry for the precautions. I'm sure you understand. Your blindfold stays on for now. You've traveled quite far to find us. Well, this is where the real leg of your journey begins."
RIDDLE 1
Tbone: "I assume you know who I am?"
Answer: "Tbone"
Tbone: "Ah, so you did your homework. That's good. You are correct. So you know who I am...but do you know yourself? To know oneself, you must first know the world around you. That which gives life and takes it.
Riddle 2: For insance, there is that which has no legs, no feet, and no shoes, yet it is able to run. It gives you health, life, and sometimes fun.
Answer 2: Water
Tbone: "That's right - the true source of all life. But the difference between life and death is a very thin line.
Riddle 3: There is that which shall live if it is fed but die if it has a drink.
Answer 3: Fire
Tbone: You have a very good understanding of the elements. I'm impessed. The elements of our world can be manipulated to both heal and destroy, and those that truly understand their power can achieve great things. But we all have limits - boundries - that cannot be changed.
Riddle 4: Some say that it flies, and in it all things will die. Not until it has been measured is its existence shown, but you will miss it once it has flown.
Answer 4: Time
Tbone: Very estute. Time is one rule that every living being is forced to follow. It is important to know that while today may be your time to destroy that whose time has come, one day even your time will be up.
((This dialogue continues in pitch black, with a serious of riddles or questions to test the potential's knowledge of perhaps Angelic power, Darkfall trivia, or thought-provoking insights. After the final question...))
Tbone: "I think it's time for that blindfold to come off and for you to make your own choices..."
Flash movie that we have currently made plays. We'll probably need to find a way to make a smooth transition into it.
Ok, that's a really really really rough skeleton. Obviously I gotta flesh out the middle.
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So Adad, our main Flasher (haha) is leaving town Friday thru Monday, making progress on this fairly difficult. We need to decide whether to leave it down for that long of a time (potentially a week or two) or just sneakily extend the end date of our recruitment for a week. To give an you an idea, two weeks has yielded over 30 applications, which is essentially 15-20 really good members we could be missing if recruitment goes down.
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Sorry about the inopportune trip to Boston, but if anyone is in the area, let me know. It could have been worse, the game could have been released on time and I'd miss the opening weekend...
For the recruitment. maybe lame, but a transition to the video, since i plan to tweak it still anyways... the beginning hits of the blurry angel could have sort of an eye opening effect when the blurry ones are revealed if that makes sense... so its black, then it looks like an eye opening and all you see is the angel blurred, close, music hits, eye opens, less blurry angel, etc.
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Given that many of these types of Orcs & Elves games are heavily quest-based, what would you think of integrating these riddles and challenges into a mock-quest? I'm not sure how that would transfer into a flash format, but perhaps you could use it as the structure to transition between phases of the challenge (example: find a feather, click on it, it activates the dialogue posted above, which then moves on to the first riddle, progress to the next phase, rinse and repeat).
Furthermore, perhaps we could allow one or two critical choices (selecting an option again) to be made along the way which serve as a litmus test to gauge whether or not they truly fall in line with our philosophy (e.g. maintaining order and justice).
I understand that this may be a bit too much to slap together in the allotted amount of time, but it's just an idea.
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I think we should end the "open" recruitment as scheduled.
Now is the time to be very selective. What I think we should do, however is to create an RP stir on the forums. Indicate that we've had to go into "hiding" (kinda like the whole underground resistance groups that opposed the Nazis during WW2). Build mystique and interest indicating that we are looking for those who oppose evil and stand for justice to join us. (During this time, we can be quickly putting together and building the actual challenge.) Sneak links, unobtrusively into random words in our posts, signatures....whatever, that take those who find and click on them to temporary pages that give cryptic information that they are on the right path or give tid bits of info on FA.
Once the Challenge is ready, we can use the "hidden" link strategy as an entry way into the actual challenge.
....just a rough idea.
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As one who got in the "easy" way, I'm a bit reluctant to put my 2c in here, but I would like to explicitly volunteer to assist in any in- or out-of game recruitment events that are devised.
One of the things that really attracted me to Darkfall was the lack of levels - there won't be a massive rush to get to the endgame, and therefore I won't have to sacrifice fun in order to try and catch up in my limited play time. So I'd love to have an active roll in helping out with events, and, frankly, in weeding out unworthy applicants. I may not have been here long enough to feel any degree of elitism, but the FA vision and style are clear, and I hope I'm a part of building the kind of success and reputation in Darkfall that you enjoyed in Matrix Online.
**EDIT** I'm volunteering this way because, unfortunately, I have no flash or web design skills :(
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I'll lend as much help with the Flash as I can but due to my obvious time restraints I may not be able to give this all of the attention it deserves. The idea sounds great btw.
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How you all can chip in for the mean time is let's pool together riddles, brain stumpers, logic twisters that stick to the following:
Stay in character as much as possible
follow the fa core principals
if possible stay angel related
are set within the fantasy realm / time / universe of darkfall online.
So put together any riddles (text of visual) and we'll start compiling the test here.
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*Thinking outside of the box* or even better a box omg omg a rubix cube! lol that forms a cool picture of THE [FA] would take the persistent a dedicated member would give eh?
*to new to speak*? climbs back in cave lol
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This site has more than a few things that will blow your mind, just click "next" or "prev" in the top left corner.
Maybe a jigsaw-like puzzle where someone has to move the frame pieces to say "Angel"
http://www.michaelbach.de/ot/cog_blur_nsx/index.html
There are definitely other things in here to base some type of riddle off of.
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This is what I have so far.
Please keep in mind... this is just a sample, the final version would be in flash with voice acting and fancy stuff. Please only judge this on the questions, story, etc.
Password is angel2009
http://omeganerd.com/fa/chal/
Your feedback is appreciated. I'd like to see how many of you pass it 100%. I plan on adding much more but I am wanting to gauge how difficult the questions are. Please do not post answers.
Edit: Also, I only have 6 questions right now... I will be adding more.
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These answers can be found simply by going to one location: the Darkfall site. These are good for initial questions or conversation fillers, but they are a little too simple. I'm assuming that you're going to include puzzles/riddles that requires the potential use a little more brain power and exhibit their depth of thought and ability to problem solve and 'research'?
I guess my first question from an RP point of view would be, why would we be asking a potential these questions? If we can fit questions into the conversation that actually sound "natural" that would be cool. Then maybe send them off on a "quest' that involves the more difficult riddles, puzzles and what not.
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questions 1 - 3 were trivia 4 - 6 were puzzles did you not complete the whole thing?
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end US recruting - go for EU's :>
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questions 1 - 3 were trivia 4 - 6 were puzzles did you not complete the whole thing?
No, sadly, I did not. I am at work. Will take another look when I get home.
end US recruting - go for EU's :>
We are US based, bro.
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added two more questions.
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I got 0 out of 8 :(
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PM me for hints, etc
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OH! We're supposed to pass?! :S
I as just putting silly things down, really... haha.
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yes, you're testing the difficulty of the questions
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Ooo I like question 7.
First thing I've been really stumped on.
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A little clarification of the crappy quiz software I used for this thing. It will allow you to go to the next question EVEN if you got it wrong. So even if the scrpt says "correct" you wont know until you get to the end if you got 100% of them correct.
Also we're all on a deadline so please if you could all spend some time on this it would help me out a lot.
Edit: updated to the new software so this is no longer an issue.
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i got 4 of 8 but it sounds like at least one or two were wrong soley because the only allowed correct answer was more specific than what I put, so I think I had 6 right. I threw a guess for some, so I bet I would get it within 30 minutes if it told me I was wrong so I knew to keep looking.
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OK, update!
I found a new piece of software that won't allow you to move on until you get the answer right. Disregard the old test. This is the new test!
http://omeganerd.com/fa/chal/
Good luck.
password is still the same angel2009
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OOoohhh... interesting Likwid. I'd say if you could add some stylized images or font, but it's a great idea!
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lits, it's all going to be done in flash. My thingy is only to test the questions and riddles. Once everyone agrees on the riddles then someone who's a much better writer than me can tweak the "script" then move on to a story board, then record the voice acting then get to the flash animation.
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As one who got in the "easy" way, I'm a bit reluctant to put my 2c in here, but I would like to explicitly volunteer to assist in any in- or out-of game recruitment events that are devised.
One of the things that really attracted me to Darkfall was the lack of levels - there won't be a massive rush to get to the endgame, and therefore I won't have to sacrifice fun in order to try and catch up in my limited play time. So I'd love to have an active roll in helping out with events, and, frankly, in weeding out unworthy applicants. I may not have been here long enough to feel any degree of elitism, but the FA vision and style are clear, and I hope I'm a part of building the kind of success and reputation in Darkfall that you enjoyed in Matrix Online.
**EDIT** I'm volunteering this way because, unfortunately, I have no flash or web design skills
Ditto. I'd love to help but don't feel certified or skilled enough to offer an opinion, I've only been here a week after all. I could do some voice acting though. Lits says I sound older than I actually am which is pretty awesome, although that counts for nothing in terms of talent.
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READ IT AND WEAP:
(http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j90/maddogjwn13/Passed.png)
passed Lik's little trial test. Not to sound pompous, but I think it's a bit easy as it stands. It took me less than 20 minutes, where as the MxO trials took me 3 or 4 days. But, great start, and I think if the dialogue was reworked a bit we could make this fit the Darkfall world really well.
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OMG that last question.... *facepalm*
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It'd be nice if the riddles could tell a story. Right now it's kinda like:
"I don't trust this dude."
"Me neither...I've got it! What lives when fed but dies when it has a drink!"
Some of them are good, though. The example listed above actually is put into context once you learn the answer. I don't really like the dialogue, to be honest. I don't like us to seem paranoid and, well, retarded like "omg he could be an alfar". The story should be more about self discover.
Some of the answers could be put into the context of a personal discovery story. Others (such as the last one) could not and are completely random. I say focus on the ones that pertain more to the game and to the Angels. Don't worry too much about the dialogue...I can adjust that. There won't be two people in the room. Just Tbone, I think.
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My take:
Took me about 20 mins total, giving time to try to come up with a couple of answers before googling...
I really like the first 3 questions - game lore and especially Mirdain lore is great stuff to ask.
I'll talk about the riddles without giving away the answers, if I can....
I couldn't figure out 4 and 8 on my own (giving just a few minutes to think about each), but easily googled the answers in less than 10 seconds each. Number 4 (it runs with no feet) I probably could have gotten if I'd taken more time, so difficulty isn't the issue. Number 8 (the tool that dies if given drink) I'm not sure I would have gotten, as I tend to think of tools as something created by hand for a specific purpose, which works here loosely at best.
The rest I got almost instantly.
I really liked riddle number 5 (the image in you mind). Very appropriate for the genre.
Overall, a great start. I particularly like how the dialogue gives guidance into the FA mindset. Feels very "chaotic good" (shout out to the D&D fans). A very good "first step", in my opinion.
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Awesome feedback. I don't care about the dialog at all. Like I said I'm a shitty writer and I'm hoping that you guys rewrite it to make it fit. I just wanted to give an example of how they would flow together.
My biggest fear was that I'd be making it too hard which is obvious that it's not. So let's expand and kick it up a notch.
I'll add some more tomorrow. Feel free to add some awesome riddles in this thread and I'll start incorporating them. Once we have a final set of riddles and questions we'll give them to tbone and he can script something around them.
Good work guys!
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Also, I'm really having troubles coming up with angel / game related ones. Please help with that.
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I've been surfing around trying to find some genre-related riddles, but I've also been thinking about the whole format, and I have to ask, are riddles really the way to go?
First of all, as I quickly discovered when I took the test, the answers can be googled very easily. So we have no idea if the applicant has any intelligence or not. Secondly, rating the difficulty of a riddle is very hard - minds just don't work alike. So even if the applicant didn't cheat to find the answer, I still wouldn't consider their score indicative on how smart they are (or, of course, what kind of person they are).
Finally, is riddle-solving really a skill that is useful to us? I suppose tactical or roleplaying questions would be more relevant, but they are also subjective and really hard to nail down to a few-words, correct-or-not type of answer.
I get that we want to make applicants jump through a few hoops to ensure that they are truly interested, motivated, and, hopefully, dedicated. But I'm thinking that they should be relevant hoops. How to work that into a flash-type, out-of-game format is something I'll think about tomorrow at my boring-ass job.
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I think what we're looking for is an a situation where the potential has an encounter with members of FA and are led/sent on a path of self discovery and trial where each riddle that is solved leads them along the path to the next stage. Each riddle/puzzle should be relevent to the situation. Perhaps even have questions that have two or more answers that lead the potential along a slightly different paths.
There should be a focus and a specific message to the "quest riddles" as opposed to random riddles presented with no apparent point or purpose.
Its late and I don't know if my intent is coming across clearly and maybe when I read this tomorrow I can explain better.
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I managed to complete this in about 20 mins as well. I thought it was pretty fun though, haha! My thoughts are similar to what everyone's already been saying. I think it's effective as an initial filtering. This will weed out the least dedicated, but it's still simple enough that many will get through. I think it's a really good start though. I imagine this alone would probably buy us a small amountl of rep in the darkfall world, hahaha.
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This may be too late to consider given that we're looking to get this up ASAP, but should we have a few different riddles to pool from so friends can't simply share answers with each other?
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This may be too late to consider given that we're looking to get this up ASAP.....
I'm not sure what the rush is unless we're expecting this game to crash and burn withing 6 months. (I'm not saying we take 6 months to build the challenge btw.) If we do a good job and put up a good challenge, this alone is a great recruiting tool. It will be passed along by word of mouth. Our challenge NEEDS to live up to our reputation and mystique and not come off like a quick rush job.
but should we have a few different riddles to pool from so friends can't simply share answers with each other?
I agree with this 110% if it is possible.
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*know im new* but thats excellent thinking
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*new* Try'd to delete last post
How would you go about making the questions random? and would it still be based on the same concept as the riddle with the 2 FA talking back and fourth still? or would it be harder to set up a random thing like that to go along with the flash based riddle *I believe it was flash*
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This may be too late to consider given that we're looking to get this up ASAP.....
I'm not sure what the rush is unless we're expecting this game to crash and burn withing 6 months. (I'm not saying we take 6 months to build the challenge btw.) If we do a good job and put up a good challenge, this alone is a great recruiting tool. It will be passed along by word of mouth. Our challenge NEEDS to live up to our reputation and mystique and not come off like a quick rush job.
Yeah, I agree completely. While this is an extremely fertile time for recruiting, a truly unique and stylish recruiting method will win over a steady stream of quality applicants over time. Best to get it as right as possible from the get-go.
but should we have a few different riddles to pool from so friends can't simply share answers with each other?
I agree with this 110% if it is possible.
It's not even relevant with the ability to search up the answers on the internet. Unless either we completely reword each riddle (which is very difficult as most riddles require a play on words to work), or create entirely new riddles. But that would be pretty difficult work with a very limited utility.
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I think what we're looking for is an a situation where the potential has an encounter with members of FA and are led/sent on a path of self discovery and trial where each riddle that is solved leads them along the path to the next stage. Each riddle/puzzle should be relevent to the situation. Perhaps even have questions that have two or more answers that lead the potential along a slightly different paths.
There should be a focus and a specific message to the "quest riddles" as opposed to random riddles presented with no apparent point or purpose.
Its late and I don't know if my intent is coming across clearly and maybe when I read this tomorrow I can explain better.
Yeah, this is more along the path of what I'd like to see. Have any of you ever read those fantasy/sci-fi adventure books? It would spend a page or two spelling out a scenario in which you find yourself (as the main character), and then a decision would have to be made. There would usually be between two and five possible actions from which to choose. You'd pick one and the book would have you turn to a certain page to see what happened, continuing the story or, occasionally, detailing your grisly demise and sending you back to the beginning.
While this type of thing would certainly require a much greater investment in time to set-up, I think it'd yield much better results and set it further apart from any other existing recruitment method.
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The best thing you guys could do is assist with riddles. Come up with some riddles that pertain to the game. We will get a final list going and go from there.
It's easy to say, "the questions or riddles need work"
What's more useful is, "They need work, how about something like this _________"
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Challenge discussion moved here: http://thefuriousangels.com/index.php?topic=5428
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i like those adventure books, made me feel smart when i finished a 150 page book in an hour ;)
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ummm....really?
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lol
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There may be another thing I might suggest adding to your list of things that help you feel smart.....
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You guys are having good ideas for Recruitment 3.0. The purpose of this next step is to add an obstacle or two to the already created flash movie. We could spend another half a year creating a complex system of thousands of riddles to pool from and a tree-like system that branches out into multiple endings, but that's for another day.
We don't want it to be sloppy, but we don't want it to be complex. It's ok if you can clear through it in 10-20 minutes. I know our older members are used to things on very hard mode, but to be honest I've got all my talented coders and thinkers already working on projects as it is, and it's not fair to demand the complexity you guys crave right now.
For now let's keep it simple. We will make sure it is polished and nice, but I'm thinking maybe 5-6 riddles via a simple convo with Tbone. Yes, they should be self-discovery driven. I'm going to try to do voice work for all of it. For now keep those other ideas in your pocket for another day.