CCR Petition

[Anonymous]

Thread: http://mxoboards.warnerbros.com/forums1/thread.jspa?threadID=1540&tstart=0 This thread has been going on for some time, and has not been locked. No forum MOD has stepped in to straighten this thread out or enforce the CoC, but yet again the Furious Angels are being brought up indirectly as exploiters. I must say, I'm getting quite tired of seeing my good faction's name being tossed around and flamed about this community, all based on misunderstandings and miscommunications. Action needs to be taken. If you go to the 13th page, the 4th post from the bottom, you'll clearly see that FarrenJ from the Collective makes a direct remark about the Furious Angels, referring to the fact that our Faction uniform is white. "The ones they blatantly caught have already been suspended. Bad guys dress in white sometimes apparently." I'd like to know just how in the world FarrenJ, from the Collective, on a completely different server than us has this knowledge? Don't you people have some kind of privacy policy or something... A select few in our faction have been accused and warned of an exploit that we didn't even know existed... Some were even banned for a 24 hour period for a completely different "exploit" that we weren't aware of in the first place. Not only do we have to take this abuse from the community, that's not enough... but now we seem to be TARGETED by the staff? Why? What is our transgression? We have done nothing but try to be a great positive influence on this community and for this game, and we aren't even getting the consideration, as customers, that we rightfully deserve. We have been flamed, flagged as "exploiters" for an exploit(s) that we didn't even know existed until it was too late, we have been warned, banned, and now we don't even have the comfort of a privacy policy... where does it end? Are you actually trying to drive us out of this game? Do you not value your PAYING customers? I don't want some scripted feedback message... I want some real solutions to these problems, I've had it with all that has been going on in the past week or so... This stuff has got to stop. When will we get a real person, to give us some real help, some real responses to these issues? WHEN?

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Hello Kevin, Thank you very much for reporting this violation of the Guidelines for Player Conduct. The Matrix Online team takes the GPC very seriously, and the details of this petition will be investigated and handled accordingly. We appreciate you taking the time to bring this matter to our attention. If there is anything else with which we can assist you, please let us know. Regards, mxo.urbanwolf

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"I don't want some scripted feedback message... I want some real solutions to these problems, I've had it with all that has been going on in the past week or so... This stuff has got to stop. When will we get a real person, to give us some real help, some real responses to these issues? WHEN?"

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Hi Kevin, We have reviewed the thread in question and currently do not see anything in this thread that would justify it being locked and deleted. In regards to your other questions, we have strict rules against discussing anything about someone's account with a third party. If you have evidence to the contrary, please file a CSR feedback petition with details. When submitting to this queue, you will receive an automated response immediately, but we do read and investigate every petition submitted to that queue. We also are not targeting the Furious Angels or any other faction for specific action. We treat every case individually on it's own merits no matter what group affiliation that individual may have. I hope this will alleviate some of your concerns. While we appreciated the contribution the Furious Angels, and many other factions, we expect that all players will abide by the Guidelines for Player Conduct. Thank you, mxo.Shift

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Thank you shift, I appreciate your personal attention to this petition, I realize that I may have seemed a bit angry earlier, it's been quite stressfull the past couple of days, but I do appreciate your attention to these issues. I can assure you that my faction will do the best we can to abide by all of the Guidelines for Player Conduct, CoC and ToS... and I promise that not one of us would ever even consider using an exploit of any kind knowingly.... I do believe there has been some confusion though... Regarding the definition of particular exploits, for instance... Friday a member of my faction was banned for using some kind of "invisibility" exploit that we weren't aware was ever considered an exploit. Things like this... I understand you don't want to tell the entire community the specifcs of every known exploit, but how are we going to be sure if we are exploiting or not... In some cases it's obvious what an exploit is, in others it's a tad shady... and with this "invisibility" exploit we would have never even thought about it being considered an exploit... These are a few of my concerns regarding the exploits that we have been charged with recently.

[Kosila]

==My Petition==
With all due respect, grinding missions is not an exploit! Using the invisible ability to become invisible from NPCs is not an exploit! Declining a mission because it is bugged is not an exploit! Declining a mission because it spawns over 1500 meters away is not an exploit! Doing missions within a small area because it spawns that way (without declining once) is not an exploit. Opening a door while invisible is not an exploit. The Matrix Online officials have gone too far. At one point or another, MxO officials have told our members that all of the above are exploits! The Furious Angels are simply trying to play the game honestly and positively, and we are being bashed down by the CSRs. We are following the rules, but the rules are starting to become unreasonable. Just because we are leveling fast, does not mean everything we are doing is an exploit. We simply are able to run missions more efficiently than other people! Plus, we play the game a lot. Therefore, we deserve to be at a higher level than other people. We are not using exploits. We are playing the game fair. We use the abilities in the ability tree wisely and how they are supposed to be used (by description and by intuition). That is not an exploit! It is okay to level up fast. Everyone is going to be level 50 anyway! We are NOT going to stop playing the game just because we are level 50! Let us be! Why slow us down? Why cause us to feel insecure? Why are you banning our accounts for political/marketing reasons and not because of real exploiting? What are we suppose to do? Not run missions at all? Not use the system at all? The Matrix Online Staff is not being fair. They are not being reasonable. We are paying for the game and we are practicing positive game play. Please answer the questions in this petition and please do not mark it solved without a real answer. Please do not send me an auto-answer or pre-written answer. I am also contacting a staff member of Warner Bros. Entertainment Inc. about this issue.

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Response (mxo.einherjar)
Thank you for contacting us today. The users that were suspended were warned multiple times to stop using factors that, when combined, made getting experience from completing missions unfair and contrary to the intent of mission experience. None of the single factors you listed in your message is an exploit, but when they are combined in a way to alter the game to receive an unfair advantage, we believe that that constitutes an exploitation of the intended use of the mission system for personal gain. We believe that it is necessary to curb the abuse of this problem for the sake of players who choose to play the game as it was intended. Thanks again for contacting us today, and we hope this answers any questions you may have had concerning this problem.

[Anonymous]

Nothing but ambiguity.. it seems they still don't understand.

[Anonymous]

My turn. Here is my petition saga....
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This petition is not a rant. This is a heads-up to you guys. Consider it an act of good faith, because I truely love this game and would like to see it succeed. I am a member of The Furious Angels. A faction you are undoubtedly familiar with. Recently there has been several accusations thrown at us, that are at the fault of MxO staff. Here are the facts, listed in no specific order: 1. A mission bug was found and reported by FA. 2. We inquired as to whether it was a possible exploit. 3. We were told it is not an exploit by MxO staff. 4. We then proceed to use it. 5. We all get letters warning us that we are exploiters. 6. We stop. 7. We are told that the warning letter was not an official warning. 8. Several FA members have now been temp banned due to the fact that they had already received a warning letter. Now, let me get into all the things that are wrong with what I just detailed for you. First, let us begin with the so-called exploit. 1. You find a location near edge of map or high mob level. 2. Recycle missions from a single location until you get the desired distance. 100m or less almost guarantees the mission will all spawn in same building. 3. Run mission to completion. 4. Return to original position, repeat. Now, this method doesn't necessarily work very well in most locations. I really feel that once you get all the movement speed buff items, random spawning missions, no matter what the distance, take about the same amount of time. It has never been much of an exploit. If it truely is one at all. Now I would like to address another issue with this. We have always been a positive influence on this comunity. Now knowing that, and knowing that we DID in fact report this, how is it that we are treated like exploiters. This so-called non formal warning letter that wasn't supposed to follow us around is now haunting several of our members. I won't even run a mission anymore due to the fact that people are getting banned for no reason. Examples: 1. Ristan - Banned 24hrs for cancelling a mission that asked him to kill someone. Ok, first of all, missions are spawning incorrectly. Assassin missions shouldn't spawn when you call infiltration or retrieval. But they do. So we are forced to cancel them if we are running solo with a low level spy loadout. CSR banned him and would not listen due to the fact that he had received a letter. 2. Doan - Banned 24hrs for cancelling a bugged mission. Elevator door wasn't there. The guy had been running every mission that popped up. He gets banned for cancelling bugged missions because of that warning letter. You realize how annoying it is to run missions that you know have a good chance of being bugged just because you are scared to cancel them. I had a bugged mission yesterday and logged off instead of cancelling the mission. You people are banning honest gamers. You aren't listening to anyone but the rest of the comunity who all think we are exploiters now because of MxO staff. Well, I won't be playing for a couple days. Many others may be leaving longer than that. If you were in my shoes I am sure you would see why. If you are interested in keeping my business, please explain how MxO staff intend to fix this and make it up to the players that you have wrongly accused and punished. Good Day.

CSR Response:
No matches were found. (It was also locked and closed)

My Response:
Why was this locked and marked solved? Why would "No matches found" answer or solve my concerns? Please reply to my original petition.

CSR Response:
*Nothing* It was just closed and locked again five minutes later. Weird??

My Response:
Is there some sort of mistake with my petitions screen? It looks to me as though this was marked as solved again. I expect a response please.

CSR Response:
Hello Bryan, First of all, we would like to apologize for not responding to you sooner. The petition was marked as closed due to a glitch with our help system. In the initial Notice letters, it was stated that while there were no further action was being taken at that time, future abuses of the game systems (not just the initial issue) could result in further action being taken. Since that time, we have been monitoring for other behavior that has taken advantage of other flaws and loopholes. Players that had not received the prior Notice have been warned. Players who had received the notice have received 24 hour suspension. Using the Sneak ability to run past enemies, by itself, is not an exploit. However, if the disguise ability is used in a way that abuses a bug, it is an exploit. For example, if a player was able to use the Agent disguise to avoid getting killed by a real Agent in a restricted area, that would be an exploit (this cannot happen, it's just an example). What can and cannot be considered an exploit is often difficult to decide. If you are ever unsure whether a particular action could be considered an exploit, please submit a petition and ask a CSR. To ensure a faster response, please select "Conduct Violation" as the category. We are more than happy to answer any questions that you or others may have. With exploits, however, we are not able to give specific information. We will, however, be able to investigate and let you know if you should stop performing that action. We realize that this will not give you a clear picture of what is and is not an abuse of the game systems. Thank you, mxo.mastema

My Response:
Thanks for responding to my petition. I apologize for thinking I was being ignored, but I am sure you can see why, with the glitch and all. So, let me get this straight. The next time I use a skill to help me complete a mission quickly, there is a chance that because I haven't reported it, I could get banned? This is outrageous. Spy abilities have functioned in this way for a very long time. It is the belief of the entire comunity that Infiltration missions should be run in this fashion. If I was a noob starting today, that is sure as hell what I would think. Let me spell it out for you again, because you are very much missing the point. 1. We reported a bug. 2. We were told by you guys to go ahead and use it. 3. Then we all get formal warnings. 4. We all stop using the bug. 5. Now FA members are targets being followed by CSR's and getting banned for BS reasons. How can you expect any player to know that was an exploit? I can bet you that if I posted your BS response to my petition on the forums, ppl would laugh like I made it up. At the very least, you have a responsibility to the customer to let them know they are doing something wrong. Not ban them, think about it for a day, then tell them some made-up BS. I guess the same could be said about speed enhancments. I can tell you all right now, that with full speed enhancments on and evade combat, I can load up lockpicking and run thru any sort of mission untouched and very quickly. I guess I would be exploiting then. Why don't you just tell the truth. People have figured out LEGAL ways within the boundries of the game to level up faster than you intended. Now instead of fixing the problem, you have decided to bully easily the largest positive influence in the comunity. You all certainly realize that while you are busy harassing us and preventing us from lvl'ing, other factions have continued to quickly lvl up using your so-called exploits. You people were obviously unprepared for the launch of this game. You have now gone too far. To hurt the good reputations of ppl that have never wanted anything except the success of this game is more than I am willing to put up with. You people have stooped so low that you are now actually starting to believe your own BS. Congratulations guys, you now have BY FAR the worst customer service I have ever encountered in a MMO. Ban me now if you'd like. Once my free month is over, you prolly won't see a dime of my money. Unless of course you fix this mess and formally apologize for everything, but we both know that isn't going to happen. Thanks for Nothing.

To be continued?....

[Anonymous]

something tells me one of the csrs or a couple of them have it out for us, because of our popularity or use to be popularity and high standings with the °old° devs and staff has really pissed some people off at WB, so now their trying to just topple the FA and destroy it all together, lol of course you dont see that clans like the collective and the other °big° factions arnt responding in these threads, their smart enough to keep their nose out of it as much as possible so they wont be targeted next.  whatever happens tbone, dont let em get to you, its a bunch of shit and everyone in this clan knows it, even the other clans know it, but wont back us because their afraid what will happen, man im half way across the world, and i havnt even played the game yet, but from what ive heard, this sounds like TOTAL bs.

[Anonymous]

Response (mxo.einherjar)
Thank you for contacting us today. The users that were suspended were warned multiple times to stop using factors that, when combined, made getting experience from completing missions unfair and contrary to the intent of mission experience.

?!?!?! MULTIPLE TIMES??!?!?!? what???

[Anonymous]

It seems to me that there are two different issues here.  The first being mission recycling, the other using spy abilities to complete missions.  The problem is that the CSR's appear to be only addressing the mission recycling issue which we all know is an exploit.  They don't appear to realize that what we are asking about is if using invis/disguise to get through missions is an exploit and focusing strictly on the mission recycling.
Someone who can get in touch with a dev or someone higher up on the food chain needs to get the spy ability question answered and then have them pass that information along to the CSR's.

My 2 cents is that the the CSR had a lapse of common sense by including the spy abilities in their response, and was referring to the mission recycling issue.  Wether or not that actual mission recycling issue occured is a moot point now, I think we all just want to know about the status of using spy abilities to complete mission objectives.

[Anonymous]

nah not common sense, their just out to topple us.

[Kosila]

I submitted a peition asking if the mission bug is fixed and if we're allowed to decline/abort missions if we don't feel like doing a certain mission. I got this responce:

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It is not against any policy to decline missions, we understand that there are missions that, for one reason or another, are not desireable to players. However, repeatedly taking missions inside the same building, (as in declining/aborting any mission over 50m away,) is considered an abuse of the game mission system. Please refrain from this activity as much as possible. I understand that the distance you must travel for a mission can be frustrating, but we do ask that players not base their acceptance of a mission on the distance you must travel, as this is not in the spirit of the game. Thank you for your understanding, ~ MxO November
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So does that mean that if I get a killing mission while doing retrieval I can abort?

[Anonymous]

Based on that reply Kosila I'd say so. It seems that they only want the intentional cancelling and aborting of missions because of distance to be stopped, but bugged or extreme distances (like at lower levels) is alright. Just don't do it too often. :p As far as the killing, I'd be careful on that, cause you might get a string of them in a row, my two cents.

[Ketamininja]

Response (mxo.einherjar)
None of the single factors you listed in your message is an exploit, but when they are combined in a way to alter the game to receive an unfair advantage, we believe that that constitutes an exploitation of the intended use of the mission system for personal gain.

What?
Exsqueeze me?
the intended use of the mission system for personal gain
Isn't this is the point of the game?
I purchase the game, on the very notion that I MUST create a character to play, that I must personally upgrade the character to persue and continue the game (ie try out different abilities, areas, etc). I run missions for PERSONAL GAIN (well, RSI gain).

Can someone confirm that the dev is basically saing, if YOU do something in game that affects your characters levels or abilities, then this is exploiting?
If you do something in game that affects another character (or group of characters) then this is legal?

I think not, I smell BS from some people.
I think they are not sure in the MxO camp, running around like headless chickens.

[Anonymous]

Is it just me, or did all this seem to start after someone in the MxO staff let slip that they were considering paying big factions?

*sigh* There must be a way to go over the heads of the CCR team if this treatment continues.

[Anonymous]

theres always someone higher up in the food chain =)